About Store Forum Documentation Contact
Donations:
309$/mo



Post Reply 
Beginner and Demo
Author Message
grouikfr Offline
Member

Post: #1
Beginner and Demo
Hello,

I am a developper but have close to zero experience in game developping. I've been unemployed for too long and I'm trying to get hired in game industry. I though a great addition to my CV would be to make a simple game, and Esenthel seems to be the best engine for that.

I've seen that Esenthel was free to use for non-commercial use (src: http://www.esenthel.com/wiki/index.php?title=License) , and my project is 100% personal, but when I start working with demo, I found out it was very limited.

To try the engine, I bought the MMO source at 5$, but I can't customize it since it's limited to 64 elements (including removed ones).

I can't afford spending $150 to realize I might or might not be skilled enough to do my own little game.

So my question is, it the engine really free to use for non-commercial use, or you have to buy it first ?

Ben
03-30-2013 03:27 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Scarlet Thread Offline
Member

Post: #2
RE: Beginner and Demo
Hi and welcome to Esenthel.

Well the full engine isn't free to use for non-commercial use, only the limited demo. When it was Esenthel 1.0 editor, there was a free for non-commercial use version so I have a feeling that what you read was the residue of Esenthel 1.0 and maybe it hasn't been updated yet.

Fortunately, You can do a hell of a lot with just 64 elements. I would recommend giving some really really simple game a go under the limit just to test if you have the skills. But heck we aren't all born with the skills we learn them over time so that's something to think about too I guess.

Also if you have "close to zero experience", I would recommend staying away from MMO's for.. well in my opinion 'ever'.. even though there is an example. However, despite my opinion it is the general consensus everywhere that you should stay away from MMO's for a long time until you are very experienced in Game Dev.

Game development is a very hard and long slog if you want to do a half decent job especially if you have "close to zero experience." You have to be very motivated to learn and never give up even when it feels like you're sweating blood (it happens a lot). I started in GameDev about 2 years ago now and I now almost have a demo of my game. That's not because I've been just slow working on the one game... it's because it takes a while to catch up to speed with learning how to develop games and also to take on a project that wasn't too highly scoped. I had about 3 projects that I canned because they were way over scoped until I finally came up with a feasible idea. So my recommendation is avoid starting a game with high scope straight from the beginning. Of course learning through failure is inevitable and not always a bad thing.

I understand you are a developer, I assume you mean in the area of programming. Not meaning to be rude to 'non game dev programmers', however, I very often find that being good at programming non game projects does very little to help with game dev programming. This isn't some well known fact but just my 'general' observations over the last 3 years. A lot of game dev programming is more about problem solving and in game dev a lot of so called 'programming rules' are broken for the sake of speed. Some people say it's the 'black art' of programming and it really is a different beast. Because of this I tend to see a lot of experienced programmers going too overboard in an attempt to do everything 'the right way' as they learned it and not doing things the way that is going to get their game finished and have good performance. You may need to 'un-learn' habits that were once 'golden rules' in the past. I feel kinda lucky that Game Programming is actually the only programming I know so it feels natural.

Anyway, that was an long rant but I just thought I'd give you a 'heads up' to some issues that people need to know when they go in to game dev.... Hope I didn't offend any people with a non - game dev programming background X|.
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2013 04:36 PM by Scarlet Thread.)
03-30-2013 04:29 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
grouikfr Offline
Member

Post: #3
RE: Beginner and Demo
Thanks you Scarlet for the answer to my questions, and for these wise words about game dev. I appreciate you being frank with my lack of skill ! smile

Indeed, I should and will stay away from MMO. I've always wanted to make my own MMO and I like to learn the hard way, that's why I bought the source, and it's very simple, so quite easy to understand so far, but I will follow your advises and start with something simple.

I have learned PHP and C++ at school, and was the best of my school, there I've made a pong game, and a network card base game for 4 players with IA. That's my close to zero exp. Then I moved to developping apps and complexe websites. So I am really unexperienced in game dev.

I will tweak my project, to make it a solo RPG first. And, if I enjoy my time, and realize I'm getting good, I'll buy this engine, who seems really great, and quite cheap.
03-30-2013 04:45 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Rubeus Offline
Member

Post: #4
RE: Beginner and Demo
Scarlet's advice is really good. My recommendation would be to grab some of the free models from the Esenthel store or from various sites around the internet and make a simple, *small* scale game. Start out with something that you would find for $1 on Google Play or Steam. What you will learn on your first tiny project or 20 will be valuable beyond measure. Only then would I say start working on multiplayer games, MMOs, and even just regular RPGs.
Welcome, and good luck.
03-30-2013 04:49 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
grouikfr Offline
Member

Post: #5
RE: Beginner and Demo
thanks Rubeus
03-30-2013 05:03 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
gwald Offline
Member

Post: #6
RE: Beginner and Demo
Your unemployed, then you got all the time in the world to pick up C++ and EE.

"To try the engine, I bought the MMO source at 5$, but I can't customize it since it's limited to 64 elements (including removed ones)."

64 elements isn't even enough to run the demos so I don't get why it's so small.

When you build it creates a visual studio file, just work on that.
You can add files but not sure about objects.
But, I wouldn't start by doing that.

Work on the tuts and the 64 limit, forget the MMO.

My Blog
http://www.esenthel.com/community/showthread.php?tid=6043

I hang out at Esenthel IRC Channel
http://webchat.freenode.net/?channels=#Esenthel
(This post was last modified: 03-30-2013 11:03 PM by gwald.)
03-30-2013 11:02 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
para Offline
Member

Post: #7
RE: Beginner and Demo
Well, Scarlet Thread pretty much said everything I'd want to say. It's a shame the 1.0 just recently got removed, you just missed that.

But working around limitations is THE CORE of game development, so take the 64 elements limit as a challenge. Try to design a simple game that would work with small amounts of elements, you would get a feel for the engine and the whole gamedev process, see if it suits you.
03-31-2013 03:41 AM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
grouikfr Offline
Member

Post: #8
RE: Beginner and Demo
Yes, I really like the engine, I think I'll buy it next week with my gov check. Also, I'd like to get a confirm on that, all the tools are included in the full version ? It does seem lots are missing in the demo.
(This post was last modified: 03-31-2013 03:23 PM by grouikfr.)
03-31-2013 03:22 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Esenthel Offline
Administrator

Post: #9
RE: Beginner and Demo
Hello!
If you're talking about this page http://www.esenthel.com/?id=tools then please know it's for Esenthel 1.0
Esenthel 2.0 has all of that, but just organized differently (however it doesn't have skel/anim editors, it assumes that the data is setup correctly in 3d programs)
03-31-2013 09:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
grouikfr Offline
Member

Post: #10
RE: Beginner and Demo
Ok, thanks for the answer Esenthel.
04-01-2013 01:29 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
uNetti Offline
Member

Post: #11
RE: Beginner and Demo
hmm, wasn't the 64 elements limitation only for server connections? Last I used the demo, I could run applications just fine that has more then 64 elements, I just couldn't publish and I got that annoying popup every x minutes or so.

Also what is more important then anything, do what you think is fun, screw what everyone says, as long as you enjoy it. But I do have a fair bit of warning, this engine tend to hang on macro scripting rather then clean c++. So take your time to go trough every tutorial example a few times, cause remembering what those pesky macros did, will save your time.

Also, to start with, make 2D games, 3D starts getting complicated and you need to know a fair bit of modeling. Or at least have the help of some 3D Artists that can explain what it all means.
(This post was last modified: 04-02-2013 07:46 PM by uNetti.)
04-02-2013 07:30 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply