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Esenthel 2.0 Questions
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ronghester Offline
Bronze Supporter

Post: #1
Esenthel 2.0 Questions
I was using esenthel 1.0 since last few month and I become such a huge fan of this engine that I went ahead and got my self a license. I thought creating new object types and managing resources will be easier in the esenthel 2.0

Now when I am using esenthel 2.0 at every step I feel esenthel 1.0 was lot better.

Anyway as the product development is going towards esenthel 2.0 I am not going to whine much about it.

Here are few things that I am struggling with, they are all related to the esenthel 2.0

1. The file names are all encrypted (why they are not in just plain English)? I can't browse through the folder it feels weird.

2. 2.0 lacks the cloth and destructible object editing, somewhere on the forum it is mentioned, "all of it is possible through code" May I ask how.

3. Where can I see the cpp files, I wanted to create destructible objects and I don't know what parameters it take.

4. Interface of esenthel 2.0 is so different it feels like a new product all together, again i will have to go through the learning curve, the usual F1 also does not work.

5. What is the project structure for 2.0 , I exported my 1.0 project it is only showing me the data folder no code?

You should have the construction method documented for all the basic object type supported in the engine. If the user has to struggle for a something as simple as instantiation of the object it means a huge road block.

could you please make esenthel 1.0 sdk available? If Esenthel 2.0 is work in progress it will make sense to give people a chance to use a complete product.

The engine is good and it really has potential but you have to take care of this entry barrier otherwise there will be problem for user adoption.
08-06-2013 07:07 AM
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Tottel Offline
Member

Post: #2
RE: Esenthel 2.0 Questions
Hi and welcome on the forums!

First of all: EE 2.0 (although usable and stable) is still a work in progress and is still missing some features compared to 1.0 that will be added in the near future. You can check what, here: http://www.esenthel.com/community/showth...p?tid=1507

1. I don't think it's a bad thing. You just end up with 2 folders: 1 for all your source assets (.fbx, .tga, .psd, .max, .blend, ...) When you import them (drag/drop), they get put in the project folder as an encrypted file. Which is fine because you don't need to touch them in Explorer again.

2. I haven't used any cloth or destructables so far. It's not in the 2.0 editor, but you can check the EE RPG 2 example for cloth on the main character (wizard). Both of those features are on the way, as you can see on the roadmap.

3. There are no .cpp or .h files in EE 2.0. They're merged into 1 "code" file (which I find really convenient, btw). The best way to find info, is to just open any code file, and press "ctrl + F", then just type in something like "destruct" and you'll find everything you need. smile Just put it on "text in files" and enable search in "Engine" as well.

4. True. It took me a while to get used to the interface, and to be honest, I still prefer the one from 1.0 (sorry EE :( ). Now it just feels like a hovering GUI. But I think the asset management is pretty neat. pfft
The F1 key does not work (it guides you to these forums) because previously, it would show the help file which is currently only for EE 1.0

5. I'm not sure what you mean.


As for the instantiation, you can just get that info from the Engine files (the green folder (library) named Esenthel Engine) + the tutorials project.
But I agree, 2.0 needs a bit more features. Personally, I'm fanatically looking forward to a shader editor. smile
08-06-2013 09:50 AM
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aceio76 Offline
Silver Supporter

Post: #3
RE: Esenthel 2.0 Questions
@ronghester: I feel your pain.

There are a number of licensed users that are still using 1.0 and many have even openly expressed that they will likely not go over to 2.0 completely because of the severe changes and added "security measures" and "automation" that not all projects require or want.

-1. Some 2.0 users profess that this isn't a bad thing--until they start requiring something in their projects that need easy access to files in plain English.

-2. I am using destructibles for things that shatter when thrown, etc. This "can" be done completely through code, but in 2.0, you really would have to write a "mini-app" that just creates the destructmesh from your existing mesh. This was available and integrated in 1.0. It is coming to 2.0 though, just don't use the road map as a gauge of when it will come since that can change at any time.

-3. This is also one of those things that is highly subjective to the user. Although in general it "makes" things easier, it also removes flexibility that may be needed on specific situations. You won't know those situations until you are deep in your development and have to find ways around it. Unfortunately, this is the reality right now for coding in 2.0.

-4. Although I've tried 2.0, it goes outside of what I've been taught in ui and human interface design in college, I have a hard time adopting. I may leap to 2.0 too just like you, but I can't say when.

-5. The project structure is now relegated to the tree-view of the 2.0 ui. There are ways to organize your code files and projects, but it isn't a full editor. I fear that many who can live without the full VS editor have not taken advantage of the deep options, addons and modules that provide a much better quality of life within the VS editor. Again, if you aren't using or relying on these items, you won't know what you're missing.

I agree with you about not whining, I doubt anyone will really care anyway smile We have created a community here of "one size fits all" that if you need to do it your way based on what you've been accustomed to for 15yrs, people may think you are probably inferior and doing it wrong anyway grin
08-06-2013 06:08 PM
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ronghester Offline
Bronze Supporter

Post: #4
RE: Esenthel 2.0 Questions
Note: These all suggestions I am making to help improve this nice software. These are all constructive feedback.

Thanks for the Answers, I really appreciate it.

1. I didn't know it is some kind of encryption method. I thought it might be a encoding problem. In that case I am strongly against it. It means you are now restricting us in editing the files and sharing it. Most of the time I use notepad++ for coding (I am doing that from many years now) or VS. Now I can't do that. Esenthel editor UI is not that fluid and you will never be able to provide us the functionality that VS or other popular editing software can provide.

I will suggest to not encrypt the program files.

2. & 3. So i can't see the cpp file. How exactly i will get the information about object creation then?
Quote:you can just get that info from the Engine files (the green folder (library) named Esenthel Engine)
The header file just tell me to use the objparams and it is not written anywhere what parameters are required for destructible objects. Its hidden!

4. Interface is really not good. The developers of this engine should take some help from the community. I am sure there will be many helping hands here who will work to improve the look of this software. The accessibility is really a problem. If you want to provide a cross platform solution please make separate builds for each platform if you are trying to put everything in the same software you might screw the interface.

5. This is really not the best practice. Either you provide us a world class code editor or let us use what is already there.

So after hearing you it feels like Esenthel 1.0 was a better software in all regards.
(This post was last modified: 08-06-2013 07:20 PM by ronghester.)
08-06-2013 07:07 PM
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Tottel Offline
Member

Post: #5
RE: Esenthel 2.0 Questions
(08-06-2013 07:07 PM)ronghester Wrote:  Most of the time I use notepad++ for coding (I am doing that from many years now) or VS. Now I can't do that.

Yes, you can.. The code editor in 2.0 is not your only option. You can still use VS like in EE 1.0

(08-06-2013 07:07 PM)ronghester Wrote:  2. & 3. So i can't see the cpp file. How exactly i will get the information about object creation then?
Quote:you can just get that info from the Engine files (the green folder (library) named Esenthel Engine)
The header file just tell me to use the objparams and it is not written anywhere what parameters are required for destructible objects. Its hidden!

That's perfectly normal.. No commercial engine is going to allow you to have its .cpp files.

(08-06-2013 07:07 PM)ronghester Wrote:  So after hearing you it feels like Esenthel 1.0 was a better software in all regards.

I liked the UI in EE 1.0 more. I think the asset management in EE 2.0 is a LOT easier and more convenient.
08-06-2013 10:14 PM
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Alexsee Offline
Member

Post: #6
RE: Esenthel 2.0 Questions
1. Every thing I do requires access to names of files (e.g., sound, images). These are referenced in a user editable text file and are loaded and displayed under specific timing conditions and can number in the hundreds.

I actually stopped playing with Esenthel after realizing that there was some impasse with respect to dealing with plain files. Perhaps I misunderstand and there is another solution that I haven't considered.
08-07-2013 07:34 AM
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Rubeus Offline
Member

Post: #7
RE: Esenthel 2.0 Questions
Alexsee, I believe that is still possible with EE 2, just not the standard way of things.

ronghester, it may help to know that there is an "Import 1.0 project" option on the opening screen of EE 2. That should help get you up and running.
08-07-2013 08:53 PM
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