About Store Forum Documentation Contact
Donations:
364$/mo



Post Reply 
MMO Progress
Author Message
llynx Offline
Member

Post: #61
RE: MMO Progress
(10-17-2010 01:04 PM)Esenthel Wrote:  
(10-17-2010 02:19 AM)llynx Wrote:  Here's a couple vid's of what was going on during the test for those of you who couldn't attend ;D

Esenthel Native MMO Framework Alpha Test [Part 1]
Esenthel Native MMO Framework Alpha Test [Part 2]

Go Esenthel!

Is there any chance you have these videos without modified contrast? on youtube the contrast seems to high, I'd like to put the video on the news web page.

Uhhh sorry that's my nvidia desktop contrast/saturation settings fault :\
Those are the original video's, didn't think to turn them off, didn't really think I was going to do any recording. Sorry
10-17-2010 10:24 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Dynad Offline
Member

Post: #62
RE: MMO Progress
Esenthel are you gonna add a feature for the server that it doesn't need to create a d3d device?

There is always evil somewhere, you just have to look for it properly.
10-17-2010 10:37 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Esenthel Offline
Administrator

Post: #63
RE: MMO Progress
yeah, I'm thinking of adding it in the future.
but why do you ask? do you need it now? or do you have some specs of potential server hosting you'd like to purchase?
10-17-2010 10:58 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Dynad Offline
Member

Post: #64
RE: MMO Progress
Yes i would like it very soon... cause i can't start the server on our virtual server. At the moment i am hosting on a machine at home cause i have no other choice.

There is always evil somewhere, you just have to look for it properly.
10-17-2010 11:03 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Esenthel Offline
Administrator

Post: #65
RE: MMO Progress
let me know specs of potential server machine (especially gpu)
I'm curious what servers use for that, as most often they don't include any info about gpu at all.
10-17-2010 11:08 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Chris Offline
Member

Post: #66
RE: MMO Progress
I guess it'll be difficult finding any mainstream server packages which offer video cards (they use too many ressources). As far as I know there are some which let you send them parts (but I think they usually expect stuff like RAID controllers, and specific network adapters) Even if you look specifically at game-server hosting packages you won't find many with video cards yet... perhaps they don't expect you to do gpu-physics on the server end (if that's what peopled need gpu for on a server - but even so there are many ways around this without needing a GPU on the server)) pfft I agree with Dynad that being able to run w/o d3d devices is important for using mainstream high-reliable servers. Even better, a mode to run without rendering on linux - linux servers are often cheaper smile
10-18-2010 12:12 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Zervox Offline
Silver Supporter

Post: #67
RE: MMO Progress
Very few servers keep a graphic cards longer than the time used to install everything needed, after that remote control is used, except if the motherboard got integrated video cards.

The potential servers specs are usually whatever you can afford, alot of webservers use even old pentium 4's or even older I've seen.

For GSP's(game service/server provider), only the highest end of hardware is good enough, that is...if you want to have a little more to run on, its also much better economical to have few but more powerful hardware, firstly because of co-location space costs, if you host yourself, you get a smaller electrical bill.

Also hosting tools varies from their needs.
Where counter strike source servers need a huge amount of cpu and medium-small amount of memory(varies if plugins etc har run)
and Call of duty series need alot more memory and less cpu, also known that they need more bandwidths.

So usually the choice of hosting packages varies from the need of the application you are going to setup to run on it.

From when I worked with someone to setup a GSP we set up around 25 boxes and only used one monitor(a small rack mount monitor).
Also on 95% of game server tools, the physics are almost always just for graphical purpose on the client except if the physics objects got a parameter saying that it is essential(or rather, its not just graphical).
(This post was last modified: 10-18-2010 12:55 AM by Zervox.)
10-18-2010 12:52 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Dynad Offline
Member

Post: #68
RE: MMO Progress
Well yes the most servers don't support GPU at all only CPU. Is it not possible to run e.g the PhysX on cpu only?

For now i need to rely on the client/players if they do their collisions right but then its hard to check if someone is cheating.

In some future i want to rent some servers here: http://www.i3d.net/dedicated-servers-root-servers.php
But the problem is i don't really know if the physX will work on that. Maybe add a simple variant of collision detection for servers.

There is always evil somewhere, you just have to look for it properly.
10-18-2010 01:24 AM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Esenthel Offline
Administrator

Post: #69
RE: MMO Progress
physics can run on cpu
10-18-2010 02:22 AM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Zervox Offline
Silver Supporter

Post: #70
RE: MMO Progress
I still wonder about server side physics if they are not a tad too complex if planning to have alot of players.

I believe thats what Dynad means, is if the current Physx implementation is a little well to expensive to be used when alot of players is connected, I noticed on a dual core with 10 clients that the core it was running on was using about 7-12%, and I am pretty sure it ain't the packets handler which is using all of that as 1-2KB/s is very little, except if there is heavy(very heavy) compression on each packets.

Also regarding the GPU on servers, most hosters wont allow GPU because they dont fit the rack form-factor sizes, 1U-4U etc..meaning a GPU wont be able to fit inside the case.
Maybe it fits in 4U and/or 3U, not entirely sure, it also will add to the power expenses and initial build costs.. a 1U usually have a 150-300w, 2U have 200-350/360w, 3U and 4U between 400-600w, this also increases the costs a lot.

for data-centers bandwidth usually doesn't add too much cost, the power however does, not only does the power demand increase, the cooling systems might have to be upgraded or adjusted to cool at a higher phase adding even more to power expenses etc. The wattage on the rack does not mean the system actually uses all the power of the Power supply unit, its just a precaution to prevent them from being burnt out too fast.
(This post was last modified: 10-18-2010 01:21 PM by Zervox.)
10-18-2010 01:11 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Esenthel Offline
Administrator

Post: #71
RE: MMO Progress
in EE MMO demo the server doesn't use any physics, you can see that in the sources.
10-18-2010 01:22 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Zervox Offline
Silver Supporter

Post: #72
RE: MMO Progress
Oh, sorry havent had time to look at it yet.

Dynad: From what I see of your option of a host, regarding the packages, I doubt you would need any more than the fasttrack 1 or maybe fasttrack 2(I would opt for fasttrack 2) offerings for starters, if/when you exceed the 5000GB month deal, I would suggest upgrading to the unmetered PROMO #3 offering.

Because when you are going above 5000GB month transfers you would be in need of better hardware and pretty sure you would be in need of the extra Memory(and if needed add extra 2-6GB memory if needed).

5000GB month though equals to about 16 mbps 24/7.

Also I recommend everyone to stay away from shared 1/10/20/50/75/100mbit etc, this means that multiple people is on the same connection, meaning if one uses 50mbit/s and one 45mbit/s you only get 5mbit.
(This post was last modified: 10-18-2010 01:49 PM by Zervox.)
10-18-2010 01:24 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Dynad Offline
Member

Post: #73
RE: MMO Progress
(10-18-2010 02:22 AM)Esenthel Wrote:  physics can run on cpu

Ok how does it work? Is there a option to run all PhysX in software mode? If so how does it gonna react when there are e.g 100 players running around? The physics must be as light as possible.

And when u turn off the d3d device is the PhysX library gonna work?

There is always evil somewhere, you just have to look for it properly.
10-18-2010 04:59 PM
Visit this user's website Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
menajev Offline
Bronze Supporter

Post: #74
RE: MMO Progress
AFAIK PX automatically works on CPU if can't run on GPU and there shouldn't be bigger problems with performance.
10-18-2010 05:15 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Esenthel Offline
Administrator

Post: #75
RE: MMO Progress
yes, physx defaults to cpu if gpu acceleration is not available.
check comments on:
Physics.create(..Bool hardware=true...

physx doesn't have anything to do with d3d

builtin EE server implementation doesn't use physics at all

but if you use it, 100 dynamic objects isn't a big deal.
10-18-2010 05:22 PM
Find all posts by this user Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply