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Bones are not aligned using b3d
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TheElk Offline
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Post: #1
Bones are not aligned using b3d
Why is it when I import a b3d model into Esenthel 2.0 editor the bones are all facing up, It does not matter what program I use they are all facing up. But if I import the same model into other engines they are all facing the right directions.

I have taken some screen shoots any help appreciated.

[Image: bone_picture.png]

[Image: bone_picture_2.png]

Thank you
TheElk
09-05-2013 06:26 PM
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docrst Offline
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Post: #2
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
I have the same thing..
09-05-2013 07:37 PM
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Esenthel Online
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Post: #3
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
Hi,

This means that you're exporter sets the bone orientation vertically for B3D format.

In other engines I assume that they don't show the actual orientation of the bones, but they just draw the lines from child to parent bone.

I've imported many B3D files in the past, and not all of them had all bones oriented vertically.
09-06-2013 09:42 AM
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TheElk Offline
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Post: #4
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
Hello Esenthel

So how can this be fixed We use Fragmotion & Ultimate Unwrap3D Pro for boning and animation. How can this be fixed.

I can not afford to buy max or maya they are a little to expensive for some of us out here that play by the rules.

Thank you
TheElk
(This post was last modified: 09-06-2013 11:52 AM by TheElk.)
09-06-2013 11:32 AM
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docrst Offline
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Post: #5
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
I have used DAZ 4 and 3ds 2012 with the same problum
09-06-2013 03:28 PM
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aceio76 Offline
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Post: #6
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
@TheElk: Maya is now more affordable - http://www.tomshardware.com/news/autodes...24010.html
09-07-2013 02:40 PM
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para Offline
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Post: #7
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
I don't think Maya and Max will be particularly helpful in exporting to b3d anyway..

Yeah, you can get Maya LT at 800$, they call it the inexpensive Indie edition, but I just call it the Crippled edition for a little less money..
A much better deal is Max educational edition, which is unlimited in features but has a limit on usability which is for non commercial only. (Quite fair in my opinion, if you want to make money you have to spend money)
(This post was last modified: 09-07-2013 07:52 PM by para.)
09-07-2013 07:37 PM
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aceio76 Offline
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Post: #8
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
Well, what features would you really *need* as a game developer using Maya? That's what Maya LT is. It isn't crippled if you are a game developer, but could be considered "crippled" if you are doing movie-quality effects and other visualizations.

Yea both Maya and Max have educational licensing that is unlimited but is only valid for 1 yr (if I remember correctly) and for non-commercial use, where at the end of that period you either renew (at lower cost, providing you are still in school and can prove it) or you buy the full licensing.

Another option is to lease the license monthly, which Maya does offer as well. At this point, it becomes more of an operational cost rather than a capital expenditure paid upfront.

I'm not saying the other tools aren't useful, they are. You can use them and accomplish things similarly. But if you are a person who is using the experience gained in making your current project useful towards another role/job at a full studio, having maya/max experience is worthwhile, since that will most likely be what they would want to see from you as an artist/modeler anyway.
09-07-2013 08:19 PM
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Rubeus Offline
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Post: #9
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
The educational editions is cool and all, but for those that plan on selling their game at some point, it's an impractical suggestion. The key words there are "Non-Commercial Use".
09-07-2013 10:52 PM
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aceio76 Offline
Silver Supporter

Post: #10
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
Yes, the idea is that when you do go commercial, you can proceed using the assets you've created with the educational license as long as you upgrade to the commercial license. This is the true purpose of the educational licensing.. to convert it to commercial licenses. Talk to an Autodesk representative if you want to verify this.
09-08-2013 05:08 AM
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para Offline
Member

Post: #11
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
@aceio76, really depends on what game you want to do.. if I want to do a 2D game with pre-rendered graphics I'd have a hard time, or if I wanted to export whole levels or anything with more then 25k polys I'd have a hard time... and I don't know about MEL script but MAX script is awesome, I made heavy use of it, for batching, workflow speed-up as well as custom exporter.. of course Maya LT is still very powerful and fits the bill for most 3D games perfectly.. and I say crippled because they took an existing product and disabled features to make sure you don't get more then what you pay for, that's not indie friendly, that's maximizing sales friendly - can't afford the full price? Fine, we'll take what you have anyway and give you a portion of the goods, and when you bring the rest you can have the whole thing. Indie friendly would be paying a lower price for the whole thing based on your revenue for instance.. (RakNet is a good example)

@Rubeus, Yeah I mentioned that.. but I see a ton of non commercial projects and/or young people who want to break into the industry so it's a great deal and very practical for them.. as for the people that actually plan to make money with their games, they have to be prepared to spend some money before they can earn any, as with any other business, and if they doubt they'll make enough to cover the expenses, then they better rethink their plan (or try doing something else for profit). And one can always buy a license when they decide to go commercial, as aceio76 mentioned.

Anyway, as I already mentioned I highly doubt max or maya will be of any help in exporting to b3d, all I could find are two outdated plugins for each package. You'd be probably better off with blender, there's a script for 2.6 and a couple of other ones I didn't test.

.. back on topic ..

(09-06-2013 09:42 AM)Esenthel Wrote:  Hi,

This means that you're exporter sets the bone orientation vertically for B3D format.

In other engines I assume that they don't show the actual orientation of the bones, but they just draw the lines from child to parent bone.

I've imported many B3D files in the past, and not all of them had all bones oriented vertically.

Hi Esenthel,

could you please take some time and try to verify this? I have the same programs as TheElk (Ultimate Unwrap, Fragmotion) and did some further testing that led me to believe this might be a bug.

If the exporter sets the bone orientation vertically, then how come if I import the same B3D file back and export it in FBX for instance the bones show correct orientation and scale?

1. import original B3D file into EE, bones show incorrect orientation and scale
2. import original B3D file into UU3D, export to new FBX file
3. import new FBX file into EE, bones show correct orientation and scale

1. import original MS3D file into EE, bones show correct orientation and scale
2. import original MS3D file into UU3D, export as new B3D
3. import new B3D file into EE, bones show incorrect orientation and scale
4. import new B3D back into UU3D, export as new FBX file
5. import new FBX file into EE, bones show correct orientation and scale

Also, if I turn on show bone axes in UU3D, it shows the correct orientation at all times.

...which leads me to believe the bone orientation and scale is preserved in the B3D file somehow, if UU3D can read it back correctly, otherwise files exported from the B3D should all show vertically oriented bones?
(This post was last modified: 09-08-2013 10:42 AM by para.)
09-08-2013 10:26 AM
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TheElk Offline
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Post: #12
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
@para

Thank you you said it better than I could have.

Please Esenthel can you fix this.

Thank you
09-09-2013 11:14 PM
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Esenthel Online
Administrator

Post: #13
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
Can you please attach a B3D file which you consider to have correct orientation of bones?
Thank you
09-12-2013 10:39 AM
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TheElk Offline
Member

Post: #14
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
Hello Esenthel

I sent you a link in a PM.

thank you
TheElk
09-12-2013 11:56 AM
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Esenthel Online
Administrator

Post: #15
RE: Bones are not aligned using b3d
I'm confirming that all nodes in your B3D have the identity orientation.


Attached File(s)
.txt  Humanoid_frog.b3d.txt (Size: 25.08 KB / Downloads: 17)
09-13-2013 06:27 AM
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